Comments on: On the Unification of the Sound Awards https://designingsound.org/2012/02/22/on-the-unification-of-the-sound-awards/ Art and technique of sound design Wed, 06 Jul 2016 17:09:47 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.2.8 By: Peter Miller https://designingsound.org/2012/02/22/on-the-unification-of-the-sound-awards/#comment-3334 Thu, 01 Mar 2012 04:08:03 +0000 https://designingsound.org/?p=12368#comment-3334 Interesting thoughts Tim.

Down here in Oz we followed, for a long while, the model of sound designer which Randy picturesquely described above as ‘the grand notion’. Having learned my trade through that era (with inspiration from the magnificent tracks of Burtt and Murch and Splett) that is still how I picture what I do if I have to try and hammer myself into a category. These days the Supervising Sound Editor has become the norm here, and that role seems to have absorbed most of what I thought I did (but not all), but it isn’t a title I choose willingly because it just doesn’t seem descriptive of what I think is the most valuable part of my input. In the best of all possible worlds, I design the sound. That doesn’t mean (again cribbing from Randy) just ‘fabricating sound effects’, although that’s part of it, but is more about considering the whole scope of sound in the film and directing that sound to be informative of, and contributive to, the intent of the story. 

On a recent US movie on which I worked (and with which you will be familiar, Tim), the Supervising Sound Editor (a most honourable gentleman) insisted that I share that title with him. I think he was a little bemused that I seemed ambivalent about it, but I know he felt I wouldn’t be awarded due credit under the Hollywood system if I just took the sound designer credit. I am terribly grateful for his generosity but even now I wear that mantle uneasily because I don’t feel like I ‘supervised’ anything, really. I worked with the director and the editor and I just ‘designed’.

Personally, I’d hate to see the term sound designer go exclusively to people who just conjure up sounds. For me it would be a little like equating a carpenter with an architect. Sure, a carpenter can nail together a nice object, but that’s all it is without context: an object. In takes a designer to realise that context. In movies, in particular, that designer has to realise that context in terms of a complex dance of other contexts, and that, I believe, is a great skill.

I would hate to see the Academy drop the sound awards from the main Oscar presentations. That is the situation we now have here with our Australian Academy of Cinema and Television Arts (formerly the Australian Film Institute). As of a few years ago sound was relegated to a separate event – the so-called AACTA ‘craft’ awards. In my opinion it was a demeaning and divisive move, further rending an already-fractured industry, and cementing in the minds of audiences the idea of the film business being divided into what I call the Glamour and the Grunts.  I resigned from the AFI over it.  This idea that sound and editing are simply technical processes is deplorable and it needs no further reinforcing by film councils.

I really don’t mind the idea of the two Oscar categories folded into one, as you suggest. It might even help to focus more attention on the skills and creative talents of the sound department. For the sake of us all elsewhere in the world, you should strongly resist the Academy’s desire to push the sound award onto a technical night, though. In my resignation letter to the AFI I was, at least, able to defend my stance by using Hollywood and the Oscars as an example to follow. If they lost the sound awards, my argument loses its last exemplar. It’s a depressing thing to consider.

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By: Edwardo Santiago https://designingsound.org/2012/02/22/on-the-unification-of-the-sound-awards/#comment-3333 Mon, 27 Feb 2012 22:47:03 +0000 https://designingsound.org/?p=12368#comment-3333 After watching the Oscar Awards last night, and reading all your posts this morning (all of which have strong merit), I still think the categories already set in place are well deserved and proper. Most of you have been working with sound in film production for many years and I’m sure have held many hats along the ride and have more understanding than most when it comes to the jobs performed in each category of sound awarded. Yet for the majority of viewers, these two awards, “Best Sound Mixing” and “Best Sound Editing”, represent the best in the final stages of the creative and decision making process in sound for each film nominated. The men that received those awards actually performed those jobs that were awarded, and performed them masterfully. I’m sure deciding between the nominees is a very difficult process because whose to say which of these films soundtrack truly captured the complete essence and nature of the visual element, allowing the movie goer to be fully transported into the world on screen? They all did that. As Chris Jacobs mentioned, these are The Best of The Best. This is a way for these artists to be honored by their peers and for the public to share in their experience and hopefully be encouraged to press on to perform their purpose with as much dedication and expertise. It is inspiring.

I work in this industry with sound on set as sound utility, boom operator and production sound mixer. The latter on smaller shows requiring isolated tracks; but I learned from location sound veterans that taught me to always work hard to mix a mono track that represents each frame captured on film or CF Card. The more opportunity I get to do this the more I understand that you guys in post take what we do on set and make miracles happen. We try very hard on set to give you the best possible tracks to work with because we know you guys have loads of stress and often times short schedules, yet are required every day to create perfection when marrying the location sound tracks with the foley tracks, and the sound FX, and the music, and the etc, etc. It’s a daunting task. The person who performs edits to these tracks and the person who performs the final mix of these tracks should be awarded for their artistry and expertise. It only makes sense for these positions be honored individually. I hope that as I continue to grow in this industry, I can become better at giving you solid, clean, and robust tracks from location. We still are a team, and I like to watch you guys be honored for your hard work.

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By: | Artesãos do Som https://designingsound.org/2012/02/22/on-the-unification-of-the-sound-awards/#comment-3332 Mon, 27 Feb 2012 20:26:41 +0000 https://designingsound.org/?p=12368#comment-3332 […] designer Tim Nielsen provocou uma discussão pertinente ao escrever recentemente o texto “On the Unification of the Sound Awards” no site designingsound.org. Para Tim, a unificação do prêmio de som é importante tanto […]

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By: Randy Thom https://designingsound.org/2012/02/22/on-the-unification-of-the-sound-awards/#comment-3331 Mon, 27 Feb 2012 17:49:09 +0000 https://designingsound.org/?p=12368#comment-3331 I think all the existing job titles in sound are confusing and obscure, including “sound editor,” “sound effects editor,” “sound designer,” “re-recording mixer,” and “supervising sound editor.” Even “production mixer” is a bit of misnomer since the main job these days on feature films is to capture the sounds of actors on separate tracks, not to mix them.

I think all the jobs that merit creative awards involve “designing” with sound. So, I think all of us who do creative work in sound should call ourselves sound designers, and that on each project there should be supervising sound designers. Some supervising sound designers would be mainly mixers, some mainly editors, and some mainly fabricators of sounds; but in order to be called a supervising sound designer you need to also be in a supervising role. So, having the title “sound designer” wouldn’t qualify you for an award, but the title “supervising sound designer” would.

Randy

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By: Tiim Nielsen https://designingsound.org/2012/02/22/on-the-unification-of-the-sound-awards/#comment-3330 Mon, 27 Feb 2012 07:14:02 +0000 https://designingsound.org/?p=12368#comment-3330 Chris, well said. The main problem with the term Sound Designer is that unlike Supervising Sound Editor, or Re-Recording mixer, the term is still too vague. A big Hollywood film a few years back had at least seven credited sound designers, along with about eight others credited as things like supervising sound editors, supervising effects editors, sound effects designer, etc. It has gotten I think a bit out of hand. My basic point if I ever get time to finish it, we’ve begun to use Sound Designer as a stand in for many jobs, all of which probably had job titles already. The truth is, the terms Sound Effects Editor and Sound Effects Designer would more properly describe what 98% of the people who are calling themselves Sound Designer are doing, myself included most of the time. 

I suppose that is where the pretentiousness appears with the term. Every student film, every TV show, nearly everyone working seems to now describe what they are doing as Sound Design, when nothing they are doing has changed from the days when Sound Editing was enough of a description?

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By: Chris M. Jacobson, CAS https://designingsound.org/2012/02/22/on-the-unification-of-the-sound-awards/#comment-3329 Mon, 27 Feb 2012 07:00:28 +0000 https://designingsound.org/?p=12368#comment-3329 I don’t necessarily think of Sound Designer as the person who oversees the entire sound aesthetic for a film, it’s usually the Supervising Sound Editor, or Sound Supervisor (who may or may not be a Sound Designer themselves). I’d like to see the primary Sound Designer included in the sound editing awards if they aren’t already as the Supervisor, but often there are sometimes two or more Sound Designers on some projects.
Also, I think any time you’re combining sounds, creating soundscapes, or even choosing a particular door sound because of the way it makes you feel (or anything beyond just using the first sound you find in the library), you are contributing to the aesthetic of the film and you are “designing sound”.
As far as having one or two awards, I’m really torn on that, as you really can’t have one without the other, and yes the lines have been blurred between the different crafts. At the same time, I do feel that some films deserve awards for sound editing while others might be more deserving in the mixing front. That being said, all films that are nominated are outstanding in their own rights, the best of the best.

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By: Randy Thom https://designingsound.org/2012/02/22/on-the-unification-of-the-sound-awards/#comment-3328 Sun, 26 Feb 2012 20:23:25 +0000 https://designingsound.org/?p=12368#comment-3328 Hi, Constantine!

None of the categories of awards that are presented on the television broadcast are “technical” awards. Unfortunately people often refer to all the awards except for writing, directing, acting, best film, best documentary, etc. as “technical” awards. Cinematography is not a technical award, neither are editing, visual effects, sound mixing, sound editing, etc. They are awards given for artistic decisions, not for expertise in knob twiddling.

The Academy’s technical awards are engineering awards which go to people who design and manufacture equipment and tools.

Randy

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By: Constantine Antonov https://designingsound.org/2012/02/22/on-the-unification-of-the-sound-awards/#comment-3327 Sun, 26 Feb 2012 19:24:52 +0000 https://designingsound.org/?p=12368#comment-3327 I beg to write (in this case as a simple “civilian”), that when I didn’t know anything about the sound (it was not long ago) and when I considered the Oscar ceremony mostly as a grandiose television show, the categories “sound editing” and “sound mixing” was the most unintelligible categories for me among the others. I couldn’t understand the difference and I always thought that “sound editing” was a technical nomination and “sound mixing” – an artistic one. And I think that this question is still popular among the many peoples.

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By: Randy Thom https://designingsound.org/2012/02/22/on-the-unification-of-the-sound-awards/#comment-3326 Sun, 26 Feb 2012 18:11:28 +0000 https://designingsound.org/?p=12368#comment-3326 I’d propose something even more radical… that mixers start calling themselves sound designers too. I’ve mentioned it to a few prominent mixers. The response was more positive than I had expected, and I’m pretty sure they weren’t just being polite.

Quite a bit of the opposition to there being one sound award comes from sound editors who remember the time when there was only one sound award, and only mixers were allowed to get it. It was a big breakthrough when sound editors were given their own category, and many of them are very reluctant to give it up. Even if the one award were to go to the same group of people who get it now as two awards…. up to three re-recording mixers, a production mixer, and up to two supervising sound editors… many of the editors still feel like they would be giving up something… recognition of sound editing as a craft.

It’s a complicated issue to say the least.

Randy

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By: Tiim Nielsen https://designingsound.org/2012/02/22/on-the-unification-of-the-sound-awards/#comment-3325 Sun, 26 Feb 2012 01:49:43 +0000 https://designingsound.org/?p=12368#comment-3325 I still say its a bad idea to keep two awards because we are concerned about our ability to win those awards. If the voting members decide to vote for a musical, that’s the way it goes. We’ve seen that happen already in recent years. If we need to educate them more in sound as an art then we should be doing that too. 

I would take issue with calling the award Best Sound Design which I’ll elaborate more on when I write something here (although at this point this thread is getting into it already). Mainly you’d never get the Academy Sound Branch to adopt that term I think, and the mixers would riot :)

If anything in a two awards system the best editing award should be renamed that, as it leans the meaning of the award back towards the creative and does imply technical as much as calling it editing might. 

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